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	<title>Comments on: Congratulations Alameda Sun, you&#8217;re now the print version of the Alameda Daily News!</title>
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	<link>http://www.johnknoxwhite.com/2009/04/20/congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news/?utm_source=rss&#038;utm_medium=rss&#038;utm_campaign=congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news</link>
	<description>Mindfulness in the face of challenge.</description>
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		<title>By: Truth, Justice, and the American Way</title>
		<link>http://www.johnknoxwhite.com/2009/04/20/congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news/#comment-878</link>
		<dc:creator>Truth, Justice, and the American Way</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 00:14:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnknoxwhite.com/?p=793#comment-878</guid>
		<description>Hmmm Eric...telling folks who disagree with you to &quot;shut up&quot; does not exactly cast the Alameda Sun in the best light.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmmm Eric&#8230;telling folks who disagree with you to &#8220;shut up&#8221; does not exactly cast the Alameda Sun in the best light.</p>
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		<title>By: Lauren Do</title>
		<link>http://www.johnknoxwhite.com/2009/04/20/congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news/#comment-877</link>
		<dc:creator>Lauren Do</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 17:23:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnknoxwhite.com/?p=793#comment-877</guid>
		<description>Eric T.: I would be interested in your opinion of what both Jeff Mitchell and notadave wrote that you would consider to be legally actionable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Eric T.: I would be interested in your opinion of what both Jeff Mitchell and notadave wrote that you would consider to be legally actionable.</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Turowski</title>
		<link>http://www.johnknoxwhite.com/2009/04/20/congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news/#comment-876</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Turowski</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 17:14:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnknoxwhite.com/?p=793#comment-876</guid>
		<description>Mr. Irons
I&#039;m not particularly interested in taking the moral high ground. But apparently, you&#039;ve missed the irony that while touting some sort of editorial superiority, the former editor manages to lible himself. And as far as accountablilty goes, even if I felt that significant damage was incurred, I can&#039;t imagine trying to take a person calling themselves &quot;notadave&quot; to court. It isn&#039;t about peple announcing the paper sucks--if that were at issue, I would have eight years worth of legal actions. And everyone is entitled to an opinion. It is the publication of actionable lies, the utter lack of accountability for this that makes &#039;news themed blogs&#039; a questionable source of information at best.
And as far as being down and dirty, considering we have been railed at by pundits on both sides of this SunCal issue, I&#039;m going to call our heavy-handed writing balanced.

Eric Turowski
GM, CEO Alameda Sun</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Irons<br />
I&#8217;m not particularly interested in taking the moral high ground. But apparently, you&#8217;ve missed the irony that while touting some sort of editorial superiority, the former editor manages to lible himself. And as far as accountablilty goes, even if I felt that significant damage was incurred, I can&#8217;t imagine trying to take a person calling themselves &#8220;notadave&#8221; to court. It isn&#8217;t about peple announcing the paper sucks&#8211;if that were at issue, I would have eight years worth of legal actions. And everyone is entitled to an opinion. It is the publication of actionable lies, the utter lack of accountability for this that makes &#8216;news themed blogs&#8217; a questionable source of information at best.<br />
And as far as being down and dirty, considering we have been railed at by pundits on both sides of this SunCal issue, I&#8217;m going to call our heavy-handed writing balanced.</p>
<p>Eric Turowski<br />
GM, CEO Alameda Sun</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Irons</title>
		<link>http://www.johnknoxwhite.com/2009/04/20/congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news/#comment-875</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Irons</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 May 2009 00:09:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnknoxwhite.com/?p=793#comment-875</guid>
		<description>Mr. CEO GM (MBA too? and would that be &quot;masters in bad ass&quot;?),

Either take the high road or admit you are down and dirty with the rest of us. Or you can continue to act all high and mighty and threaten a lawsuit every time somebody says your paper sucks while at the same time telling other critics to &quot;shut up&quot;.

The same for the paper&#039;s coverage. If your reporter was really seriously assaulted, by all means it warrants legal action, but how about at least attempting to show some journalistic restraint to balance that out by not leading with editorials and little aids on the front page about getting one&#039;s signature removed from the petition? If you have the moral high ground why compromise it with all the chest beating? If you press changes on anything less than a serious incident then you will  look even more lame.

I&#039;ve not met anybody at the Sun other than Julia nor have I met Lucinda Ryan, but it was under Lucinda&#039;s editorial reign when the Journal really seemed a most outrageous tool of City Hall. I hope Lucinda doesn&#039;t sue me for saying that. Remember when she tried to do away with hyperbole by editing &quot;megaplex&quot; from letters? I think the Sun has taken a similar turn in the other direction with it&#039;s heavy handed writing.

I think most folks in town respected the launch of the Sun as an earnest effort at being a viable home grown alternative. It began to slip slowly, but lately the paper has really gone on the skids.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. CEO GM (MBA too? and would that be &#8220;masters in bad ass&#8221;?),</p>
<p>Either take the high road or admit you are down and dirty with the rest of us. Or you can continue to act all high and mighty and threaten a lawsuit every time somebody says your paper sucks while at the same time telling other critics to &#8220;shut up&#8221;.</p>
<p>The same for the paper&#8217;s coverage. If your reporter was really seriously assaulted, by all means it warrants legal action, but how about at least attempting to show some journalistic restraint to balance that out by not leading with editorials and little aids on the front page about getting one&#8217;s signature removed from the petition? If you have the moral high ground why compromise it with all the chest beating? If you press changes on anything less than a serious incident then you will  look even more lame.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve not met anybody at the Sun other than Julia nor have I met Lucinda Ryan, but it was under Lucinda&#8217;s editorial reign when the Journal really seemed a most outrageous tool of City Hall. I hope Lucinda doesn&#8217;t sue me for saying that. Remember when she tried to do away with hyperbole by editing &#8220;megaplex&#8221; from letters? I think the Sun has taken a similar turn in the other direction with it&#8217;s heavy handed writing.</p>
<p>I think most folks in town respected the launch of the Sun as an earnest effort at being a viable home grown alternative. It began to slip slowly, but lately the paper has really gone on the skids.</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Turowski</title>
		<link>http://www.johnknoxwhite.com/2009/04/20/congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news/#comment-874</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Turowski</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 17:40:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnknoxwhite.com/?p=793#comment-874</guid>
		<description>Another prime example of how valuable blogs are, notadave. Hiding behind a cute name and making libleous charges without any accountablility. How did we ever get along without this priceless format before? Make a real contribution to the community--shut up.
Eric Turowski
GM, CEO
Alameda Sun</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another prime example of how valuable blogs are, notadave. Hiding behind a cute name and making libleous charges without any accountablility. How did we ever get along without this priceless format before? Make a real contribution to the community&#8211;shut up.<br />
Eric Turowski<br />
GM, CEO<br />
Alameda Sun</p>
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		<title>By: notadave</title>
		<link>http://www.johnknoxwhite.com/2009/04/20/congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news/#comment-873</link>
		<dc:creator>notadave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 00:00:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnknoxwhite.com/?p=793#comment-873</guid>
		<description>Glad to see you are modeling such civil behavior, Eric. It&#039;s the one thing that separates you from the likes of the paparazzi that yell insults to get a photo worthy response..  And of course you didn&#039;t, couldn&#039;t have engaged in any of the same name calling in provoking the signature gatherer either, could you?  Would you?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Glad to see you are modeling such civil behavior, Eric. It&#8217;s the one thing that separates you from the likes of the paparazzi that yell insults to get a photo worthy response..  And of course you didn&#8217;t, couldn&#8217;t have engaged in any of the same name calling in provoking the signature gatherer either, could you?  Would you?</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Turowski</title>
		<link>http://www.johnknoxwhite.com/2009/04/20/congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news/#comment-872</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Turowski</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 17:21:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnknoxwhite.com/?p=793#comment-872</guid>
		<description>I find Jeff&#039;s comments interesting, somewhat self-aggrandizing, and, despite claims of responsible journalism, libelous and actionable. 
&quot;Sadly, there doesn’t appear to be anyone at the Sun with the professional training or experience to understand let alone apply these basic standards and practices that are employed everyday at quality newspapers all across our country.&quot; How many journalism degrees did you come across in that bit of opinionated research? Up for a lawsuit, Jeffy? And speaking of which, just how long did you edit the Journal, anyway? Um, and do you have a journalism degree? Does JKW, for that matter? Prove it. Try a little digging. It&#039;s good for your soul.
The reason people believe the Journal is biased toward redevelopment of the Point is because it was founded by folks with close ties to real estate. Of course, that was, what, three or four owners ago?
And speaking of which, your whining about the poor understaffed Journal is questionable. Even if the Journal is just the nail on the pinky toe of Media News, it is still a part of one of the largest newspaper chains in the nation (ads and pseudo-news story ads on the front page? Come on, Jeff. Get over your bad self.)
And if anyone thinks that the assault (yes, John, criminal assault--you might want to catch some reruns of Law &amp; Order to get at least a little bit familiar with arrestable offenses) of one of my staff members during the course of his work would go without loud and strong comment, think again. (And maybe you should squint a little harder through your Harry Potter glasses, John--our &quot;editorial screed&quot; was clearly marked &quot;Editorial.&quot; (That means &quot;an opinion,&quot; not &quot;objective reporting,&quot; for those of you without journalistic training.) 
Can you imagine the moaning, shrieking and gnashing of teeth that would go on and on for weeks should a so-called &quot;journalist&quot; from a blog get assaulted in the course of covering a story? I can&#039;t. And I doubt it&#039;ll ever happen.
As far as I&#039;m concerned, ya&#039;ll can stick your unaccountable opinions where the Sun don&#039;t shine--on &quot;news-themed internet sites&quot; just like this one.
Keep up the lame work.

Eric Turowski
CEO, GM
Alameda Sun</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find Jeff&#8217;s comments interesting, somewhat self-aggrandizing, and, despite claims of responsible journalism, libelous and actionable.<br />
&#8220;Sadly, there doesn’t appear to be anyone at the Sun with the professional training or experience to understand let alone apply these basic standards and practices that are employed everyday at quality newspapers all across our country.&#8221; How many journalism degrees did you come across in that bit of opinionated research? Up for a lawsuit, Jeffy? And speaking of which, just how long did you edit the Journal, anyway? Um, and do you have a journalism degree? Does JKW, for that matter? Prove it. Try a little digging. It&#8217;s good for your soul.<br />
The reason people believe the Journal is biased toward redevelopment of the Point is because it was founded by folks with close ties to real estate. Of course, that was, what, three or four owners ago?<br />
And speaking of which, your whining about the poor understaffed Journal is questionable. Even if the Journal is just the nail on the pinky toe of Media News, it is still a part of one of the largest newspaper chains in the nation (ads and pseudo-news story ads on the front page? Come on, Jeff. Get over your bad self.)<br />
And if anyone thinks that the assault (yes, John, criminal assault&#8211;you might want to catch some reruns of Law &amp; Order to get at least a little bit familiar with arrestable offenses) of one of my staff members during the course of his work would go without loud and strong comment, think again. (And maybe you should squint a little harder through your Harry Potter glasses, John&#8211;our &#8220;editorial screed&#8221; was clearly marked &#8220;Editorial.&#8221; (That means &#8220;an opinion,&#8221; not &#8220;objective reporting,&#8221; for those of you without journalistic training.)<br />
Can you imagine the moaning, shrieking and gnashing of teeth that would go on and on for weeks should a so-called &#8220;journalist&#8221; from a blog get assaulted in the course of covering a story? I can&#8217;t. And I doubt it&#8217;ll ever happen.<br />
As far as I&#8217;m concerned, ya&#8217;ll can stick your unaccountable opinions where the Sun don&#8217;t shine&#8211;on &#8220;news-themed internet sites&#8221; just like this one.<br />
Keep up the lame work.</p>
<p>Eric Turowski<br />
CEO, GM<br />
Alameda Sun</p>
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		<title>By: DL Morrison</title>
		<link>http://www.johnknoxwhite.com/2009/04/20/congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news/#comment-871</link>
		<dc:creator>DL Morrison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Apr 2009 00:33:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnknoxwhite.com/?p=793#comment-871</guid>
		<description>Jeff has kindly suggested that I go and do some reporting myself, and I&#039;m willing to take him up on it.  I&#039;ve already determined that the density bonus is most definitely applicable to SunCal&#039;s plans -- meaning that the supposed limit of 4800 units of housing could easily balloon by another 20% more units, which puts it closer to 5800 units.  

So how should I proceed here?  The reference to the density bonus is on pg. 16 of the Community Plan, and there&#039;s no question that the bonus will apply (by state law, with or without the city&#039;s own ordinance), so here&#039;s what I&#039;d like to do:

* Ask Pat Keliher whether SunCal is planning to use the density bonus, and how many more units of housing they might be hoping to build;

* Ask city staff what they think SunCal is likely to do; 

* Ask the Mayor whether she thinks SunCal should build more than 4800 units, and whether the process is really so &quot;transparent&quot; as she claims.  

What else should I ask Jeff?  Any suggestions?  Thanks!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeff has kindly suggested that I go and do some reporting myself, and I&#8217;m willing to take him up on it.  I&#8217;ve already determined that the density bonus is most definitely applicable to SunCal&#8217;s plans &#8212; meaning that the supposed limit of 4800 units of housing could easily balloon by another 20% more units, which puts it closer to 5800 units.  </p>
<p>So how should I proceed here?  The reference to the density bonus is on pg. 16 of the Community Plan, and there&#8217;s no question that the bonus will apply (by state law, with or without the city&#8217;s own ordinance), so here&#8217;s what I&#8217;d like to do:</p>
<p>* Ask Pat Keliher whether SunCal is planning to use the density bonus, and how many more units of housing they might be hoping to build;</p>
<p>* Ask city staff what they think SunCal is likely to do; </p>
<p>* Ask the Mayor whether she thinks SunCal should build more than 4800 units, and whether the process is really so &#8220;transparent&#8221; as she claims.  </p>
<p>What else should I ask Jeff?  Any suggestions?  Thanks!!</p>
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		<title>By: DL Morrison</title>
		<link>http://www.johnknoxwhite.com/2009/04/20/congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news/#comment-870</link>
		<dc:creator>DL Morrison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Apr 2009 00:31:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnknoxwhite.com/?p=793#comment-870</guid>
		<description>Well, for starters, I&#039;ve been reading the papers every day now for decades, and this is the first time I&#039;ve heard someone say, &quot;If you don&#039;t like the news, go get your own&quot;, but whatever -- more on that below.  

Anyway, a few points: 

JKW&#039;s comment equates the news article with the editorial, when obviously, opinion in the context of the editorial or the letters is perfectly legitimate.  JKW writes an opinion blog, so he can say whatever he wants -- but when someone who is a journalist concurs with the blog&#039;s statements, it seems to legitimize those opinions.  I think people objecting to the Sun&#039;s coverage are probably unhappy with the article AND the editorial AND the letters, but they can&#039;t say that flat out, so they&#039;re jumping on the article instead.  

I also think it&#039;s obnoxious to claim that signature gatherers are free to say whatever they wish in promoting a petition -- and that it tends to discredit SunCal and anyone who supports this process.

SunCal could have better controlled the signature process (thru its manager) while still carrying on a political campaign by any of these steps:  
* Provide the signature gatherers with pre-printed signs and forbid them to use personal signs. 
* Provide them with a list of approved statements and tell them to stick to it.   
* Make clear to them on no uncertain terms that they must not harass or follow anyone.  

Being followed is not that &quot;amusing&quot;, incidentally -- I was followed and harassed at length by a signature gatherer who was absolutely desperate to make money -- so he told me.  Having to literally run away from someone like this is not good, and should not happen under any circumstances, period.  

The reality is, people do this work to make money and it&#039;s very predictable that some rules have to be made clear up front -- and SunCal can&#039;t even get this right?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, for starters, I&#8217;ve been reading the papers every day now for decades, and this is the first time I&#8217;ve heard someone say, &#8220;If you don&#8217;t like the news, go get your own&#8221;, but whatever &#8212; more on that below.  </p>
<p>Anyway, a few points: </p>
<p>JKW&#8217;s comment equates the news article with the editorial, when obviously, opinion in the context of the editorial or the letters is perfectly legitimate.  JKW writes an opinion blog, so he can say whatever he wants &#8212; but when someone who is a journalist concurs with the blog&#8217;s statements, it seems to legitimize those opinions.  I think people objecting to the Sun&#8217;s coverage are probably unhappy with the article AND the editorial AND the letters, but they can&#8217;t say that flat out, so they&#8217;re jumping on the article instead.  </p>
<p>I also think it&#8217;s obnoxious to claim that signature gatherers are free to say whatever they wish in promoting a petition &#8212; and that it tends to discredit SunCal and anyone who supports this process.</p>
<p>SunCal could have better controlled the signature process (thru its manager) while still carrying on a political campaign by any of these steps:<br />
* Provide the signature gatherers with pre-printed signs and forbid them to use personal signs.<br />
* Provide them with a list of approved statements and tell them to stick to it.<br />
* Make clear to them on no uncertain terms that they must not harass or follow anyone.  </p>
<p>Being followed is not that &#8220;amusing&#8221;, incidentally &#8212; I was followed and harassed at length by a signature gatherer who was absolutely desperate to make money &#8212; so he told me.  Having to literally run away from someone like this is not good, and should not happen under any circumstances, period.  </p>
<p>The reality is, people do this work to make money and it&#8217;s very predictable that some rules have to be made clear up front &#8212; and SunCal can&#8217;t even get this right?</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff Mitchell</title>
		<link>http://www.johnknoxwhite.com/2009/04/20/congratulations-alameda-sun-youre-now-the-print-version-of-the-alameda-daily-news/#comment-869</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff Mitchell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Apr 2009 08:55:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnknoxwhite.com/?p=793#comment-869</guid>
		<description>First, DL, you should know that I am no longer the Journal&#039;s editor -- I haven&#039;t been since Sept. of 2007. Second, I too would like to see some paper -- any paper -- do the analysis on the Point that you mention. It&#039;s well past due. Third, you should be careful to not confuse what I was talking about in my first comment. I was referring to basic journalistic standards and practices which is commonly found in the Journal but not in the Sun. Fourth, to your charge of the Journal &quot;pushing its own agenda&quot; -- well, all I can say is that you are flat out wrong. You were wrong when I was editor and you&#039;re still wrong today, But, hey, it&#039;s a free country. Fifth, I would remind you that while we were (back then) limited in staff and resources, it was the Alameda Journal that first exposed the whole AP&amp;T cable mess and that it was Journal that exposed the expensive leasing debacle at the Point and finally, it was Journal who exposed that the city quietly paid out $25 million in a wrongful death suit to the family of a AP&amp;T contractor. We did all these stories and others because we had the professional training and the drive to help our community better understand itself and its government. 
Sixth, unlike the Sun, the Journal then and today continues to carefully separate its &quot;editorial&quot; opinions to the op-ed/letters page, where they properly belong. 
Did the Journal make mistakes when I was its editor? Sure. But everytime we screwed up, we owned up and wrote a prompt correction.
Now that the Journal is down to one reporter and one editor (both fine pros and people I might add) I suggest that you call them up and volunteer your time to help them produce the article on Alameda Point that you&#039;d like to see. Maybe then you&#039;d get a taste of what doing real, orthodox reporting is like.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First, DL, you should know that I am no longer the Journal&#8217;s editor &#8212; I haven&#8217;t been since Sept. of 2007. Second, I too would like to see some paper &#8212; any paper &#8212; do the analysis on the Point that you mention. It&#8217;s well past due. Third, you should be careful to not confuse what I was talking about in my first comment. I was referring to basic journalistic standards and practices which is commonly found in the Journal but not in the Sun. Fourth, to your charge of the Journal &#8220;pushing its own agenda&#8221; &#8212; well, all I can say is that you are flat out wrong. You were wrong when I was editor and you&#8217;re still wrong today, But, hey, it&#8217;s a free country. Fifth, I would remind you that while we were (back then) limited in staff and resources, it was the Alameda Journal that first exposed the whole AP&amp;T cable mess and that it was Journal that exposed the expensive leasing debacle at the Point and finally, it was Journal who exposed that the city quietly paid out $25 million in a wrongful death suit to the family of a AP&amp;T contractor. We did all these stories and others because we had the professional training and the drive to help our community better understand itself and its government.<br />
Sixth, unlike the Sun, the Journal then and today continues to carefully separate its &#8220;editorial&#8221; opinions to the op-ed/letters page, where they properly belong.<br />
Did the Journal make mistakes when I was its editor? Sure. But everytime we screwed up, we owned up and wrote a prompt correction.<br />
Now that the Journal is down to one reporter and one editor (both fine pros and people I might add) I suggest that you call them up and volunteer your time to help them produce the article on Alameda Point that you&#8217;d like to see. Maybe then you&#8217;d get a taste of what doing real, orthodox reporting is like.</p>
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